328 replies to this topic

[holco]

New project for a Heavy-Lifter camera platform.

The objective are,

Multiple system use, such as, Mikrokopter with the V2.0 ESC's / OpenPilot / KKuk / and others.

Hexa setup, + and X mode.

5S setup with one 8000mAh lipo for long efficient flights.

Easy removable 20mm carbon arms with integrated power and led plugs for easy transportation in a custom case with foam padding.

Carbon 180mm frame and carbon supports for the Avroto 2814 short shaft motors.

Compact Wire Rope Isolators (diy) + gel dampers for max vibration damping.

Diy roll/tilt gimbal (AV-200 look alike).

Good looks!!







Dimensions test for the MK V2.0 ESC's mounting holes,


Production of the Avroto supports in 2,5mm carbon,




The results,










First test model of a diy Compact Wire Rope Isolator, tests show a vibration reduction of 70% with 500g load,

[AlPackin]

oh boy, this is going to be good

[naiiawah]

As much as I'm fascinated in following this build as it is a really really great looking design; I am even more interested in knowing more about your CNC setup and processes.  Any chance of some sort of overview following along on your progress of how you build the parts as you proceed along with the build of the copter?


The video of the machining of what looks like the motor mounts was fascinating! Thanks a bunch for sharing that!

[Texel2001]

@naiiawah please explain a bit more about what you want to see from us.

[holco]

Some pictures.

[AlPackin]

very pretty stuff, looks like from Star Wars

[metRo_]

i can still dream for one of this

[farmer_joe]

Great build! Very impressive i have a ton of questions

Are you making your own carbon plates? Where did you get carbon tubes and motor holders, are that heli booms and boom holders?

[Malx]

holco, on 09 October 2011 - 09:42 PM, said:

Easy removable 20mm carbon arms with integrated power and led plugs for easy transportation in a custom case with foam padding.

YES!! Finally someone else also thinking about this. I have put a LOT of hours into trying to find/construct a good solution.
(Even started a thread about it here)
http://forums.openpi...removable-arms/
Looking forward to see your solution. The most difficult task is to find a good connector (or to construct a good connector yourself).
My latest versions are improved from the thread above (Now the arms are really secure) but I still not sure on how to secure the bullet connectors
in an easy "cheap" way.

[AlPackin]

Malx, on 10 October 2011 - 11:26 PM, said:

in an easy "cheap" way.

I don't believe that that is an objective of this project and I concur

[juz]

love it. Those avrotos look great without the stickers. What are the dimensions of those carbon arms?

[naiiawah]

Texel2001, on 10 October 2011 - 06:05 AM, said:

@naiiawah please explain a bit more about what you want to see from us.

OK, let me try taking a crack at how to explain this.

Increasingly, the innovation in multirotor craft is coming in frame design.  Most of that innovation is coming from folks like yourself that are doing innovative things with CNC design and fab (both material removal and material deposition).  The one area that probably fascinates me as much as OpenPilot does, is CNC for doing just what you are doing with your puzzle copter, holco with this platform and others (Felias' Quadrixette Nano comes to mind) with these CNC technologies.

We (the group here on the forum) have a tremendous amount of knowledge about various RC platforms being controlled by CC boards that we share around.  And that is GREAT!  What I have not seen nearly as much as I would hope to see, is the info on creation of some of these various RC platforms.  There are a bunch of "build logs" in the Wiki, but they deal more with "what parts" and "how they got put together".  At the same time, there is a whole group of folks, such as yourself, lurking about that appear to have this wealth of knowledge of how to make those parts using CNC technologies, not just how to assemble them.

I would like to encourage these knowledgeable folks to share how they are building these parts.  What tools are they using.  What software.  What materials.  What are the design restrictions and realities that you encounter.  How do you get started building frame parts.  Hopefully I'm getting the flavour of what I'm thinking of coming through here.

I realize there is a bunch of this knowledge spread about on the net.  Believe me, I've waded into that pool and then I realized that there is this big wave machine running that I didn't realize was there and I proceed to drown .  I go to CNC sites and quickly find folks talking about machining engine blocks or girders or something.  Knowledge about those things are probably not going to be useful to folks here I would think.  But I don't know!

The biggest stumbling block with the vast store of knowledge out on the net is not knowing what part of it is applicable when you are a newbie to the field.  When I got started on Quads, OpenPilot was a source of concentrated applicable knowledge about multi-rotor RC flight controllers versus the sea of stuff on RCG and elsewhere.   I would like to see a similar thread of discussion and education that is a distilled version of the sea of knowledge on CNC for making multi-rotor frames.  What I would love is "what you need for building via CNC on how to build a great frame for use with OpenPilot's CC (and Pro when it gets here).

It would be wonderful to see a sub-forum in the hardware section that is centered around such a discussion.  But in the meantime, all I can ask for is folks like yourself to share your knowledge.

Thanks for listening and asking!!

[Malx]

AlPackin, on 10 October 2011 - 11:33 PM, said:

I don't believe that that is an objective of this project and I concur

With "cheap" I didn't mean HK cheap. It was more "not having to order a plastic mold and minimum quantity 10 000" ... My goal is for the moment to fix the mounts (including connectors) for a quad under a total of 100 euro... .

[holco]

To give you an idee of the price to where this project is coing to.

Only the clamps (30x) and the German made high-quality carbon booms (X-HZ) cost me €200,00 without any adaptation.

[Piranha]

Nice frame!!! What are the boom clamps from???

[Malx]

holco, on 11 October 2011 - 06:55 AM, said:

Only the clamps (30x) and the German made high-quality carbon booms (X-HZ) cost me €200,00 without any adaptation.

Yepp, I guessed that !
(As you probably have seen I building most things in CF (silver hornet as example), http://www.carbon-team.de is the best place I found for larger carbon booms in Europe this far )

I'm also very curios on how you made/found the clamps. I'm worried that 3D-printing not is strong enough.

[holco]

To estimate the power and efficiency of the Avroto M2814 motors I did some testing on 5S with an Graupner E-11x5 prop.  

The test I did was with an 15x15 square alum tube, so the numbers will be a little negatief because round tubes are more efficient
(less bouncing back from the prop down wash), because of this there will also be less vibrations coming from the booms.  

The Flexacopter flying weight without camera bud with an 5S 8000mAh lipo will be +/- 3100g divided by six = 517g for each motor
with an extra payload of 1500g (heavy DSLR) the numbers for each motor will be 767g.

So the numbers we are looking for are, 517g and 767g

From 87 > 98 sec at the time line you can see the 500g test and the red line indicate that we are pulling 3A multiplied by six = 18A total with 3000g flying weight.

From 137 > 145 sec at the time line you can see the 800g test and the red line indicate that we are pulling 5,8A multiplied by six = 34,8A total with 4500g flying weight.

80% from the 8000mAh lipo give 6,4Ah usable power, this will give a flying time of 6,4÷18=0,35h  0,35x60=21min flying time with 3000g.

6,4÷34,8=0,18h  0,18x60=10,8min flying time with 4500g.

Not important bud nice to know is that the total lift power of the six Avroto's is 13,8Kg (3200W!!), so plenty of headroom

Edited by holco, 11 October 2011 - 09:17 AM.

[PT_Dreamer]

+1 interested on where you got the arms clamps.

[elmuchacho]

Amazing the small scale you've built much better then the one I've bought loved the graphics you've generated from the reading.

I've found that tool that is really useful Motor Scale Bench, Not cheap but has I didn't had the skills to build one and really wanted to make accurate measurement.

http://www.topmodel....metrique-0-10kg

Below is the bench I've put together to test the motor

From left to right on the top
- Motor scale Bench
- the 2 box contains connector adaptor and the various screw needed to fix the motor

On the bottom
- RPM counter
- Watt meter/Amp meter
- Individual cell battery analysor

[holco]

The clamps are from Mikado's Logo 400 (upgrade part).

At first we had designed clamps for 3D printing bud this turnt out very expensive and question marks about the quality over time (think about UV and vibrations)
so we decided to go for something that for sure will last over time, after a lot of internet hours and small orders we decided to go for the quality brand Mikado.